Lord Ellenborough. I only wish to avoid useless particularity; I do not wish to curtail you of the least particle of proper proof.

Mr. Scarlett. Do you know, whether, in the month of September in the last year, Mr. De Berenger had made considerable progress in that plan?

A. He had; he had nearly completed it.

Q. He had not quite completed it?

A. No.

Q. Do you know whether, shortly before Mr. Cochrane Johnstone went to Scotland in September, he made him any payment on account of that?

A. He did, through my medium.

Q. Besides the plan, had De Berenger prepared a prospectus, with a full and minute description of the objects of the design?

A. He had.

Q. Had he got that printed?

A. He had; he made him one payment of L.100.

Q. Do you know that Mr. Johnstone had got a number of his prospectus, to take with him to Scotland?

A. He had.

Q. In the month of September, last year?

A. Yes, early in October; the first or second of October, I think.

Q. Do you know of any payment made by Mr. Johnstone since that time, upon account of that plan?

A. Yes; it was not made by me.

Q. Were you present when it was made?

A. No.

Q. I understood you to say, you knew that the payment was made?

A. By letters.

Q. Were the letters sent to you?

A. Yes.

Q. They passed through your hands?

A. Yes, they did.

Lord Ellenborough. The moment it gets into a letter, that moment the parol statement ends.

Mr. Scarlett. Certainly, my Lord. Do you know whether any application was made by Mr. De Berenger after the plan was completed, for payment?

Mr. Gurney. Were you present?

Mr. Scarlett. Or did you convey any draft?

A. Yes, I conveyed a letter, and I spoke several times.

Q. To Mr. Johnstone.

A. Yes, upon the subject of the paying him for the plans.

Q. Without at present alluding to any letter, do you know what was the price that De Berenger asked for the remainder of the plans?

A. No price, I believe, was ever stipulated; no price was ever fixed till February last. Mr. Johnstone and myself had repeated conversations on the subject of the price of the plans, and as to the remaining sum that he should pay him.

Q. You made repeated applications to Mr. Johnstone to pay him?

A. I did, always in a delicate way, not saying, that Mr. Berenger required so much; but he requested I would take a mode of giving a hint to Mr. Johnstone, as to the payment; a hint he was always ready to take.

Q. Have you any means of knowing what was the money Mr. Johnstone did pay him?

A. Yes, I think I have.

Q. When was the payment?

A. In February.

Lord Ellenborough. At what time in February.

A. Mr. Johnstone sent me a letter on the 22d of February, enclosing a letter to him from Mr. De Berenger.

Mr. Scarlett. He sent to you, on the 22d of February, a letter he had received from Mr. De Berenger?

A. He did.

Q. Did you keep the letter?

A. I did, here it is (producing it).

Lord Ellenborough. De Berenger's letter was enclosed in one of Mr. Cochrane Johnstone's?

A. Yes.

Q. Were the letters by the post? had they any post-mark upon them?

A. No; this letter was delivered.

Q. The delivery and date were cotemporary with the transaction, namely, about the 22d of February?

A. Yes, it was on the 22d of February I received it.

[The letters were read, and are as follow.]

"18, Great Cumberland-street, "22d February 1814.

"My dear Sir,

"I have received the enclosed letter from the Baron; and as I mean to pay him this week for his plans, pray let me know if you have advanced him any money on my account, in addition to the L.50, which I paid him on account last year. You will perceive that he wishes a loan of L.200, in addition to this sum, and that he offers me as security, Colonel Kennedy's assignment. I have told him, that if this sum can be of real service to him, I will advance it to him, I will take his note for the amount; and if he is ever able to repay me, good and well; if not, I shall have had the satisfaction of serving him.

"As I shall receive the middle of next month a considerable sum of money, you will oblige me very much, if you will have the goodness to let me know, what it would cost me to purchase an annuity for the mother of my three natural children. I wish to settle L.200 a year upon her, and L.100 a year upon each of them; her age is 23, past; my eldest boy will be five years next May, the second boy four years next October, and the third one year next April; they are all healthy. I have in my will made a provision for them, but I wish to alter this mode of settlement for them, from motives of delicacy to my daughter, Miss Cochrane Johnstone, as I would not wish to insert their names along with hers.

"I will send you as soon as possible the statement about Lady Mary Lindsey Crawford, to enable you to give the answer to the bill in chancery.

"Pray settle my account with Dawson and Wrattislaw, as I wish to clear off all demands upon me as soon as possible. Whatever sum you say they ought to receive, I will pay them. I hope you are expediting the Wendover papers.

Believe me to be, my dear Sir, yours respectfully, A. Cochrane Johnstone."

Addressed to Gabriel Tahourdin, Esq. King's Bench Walk, Temple.

"London, February 22d 1814.

"My dear Sir,

"I beg to assure you, that I would not have complained to you of the disappointment and inconvenience which Colonel Kennedy's unreasonable delay of completing the purchase of the share in the oil patent created, had it not reached your ears from other quarters. I cannot agree with you, that his "want of cash" is a sufficient excuse; because in that case, he ought to have stated that instead of artificial reasons. Had he completed his contract at the price agreed on, namely, L.1,500, I should be liberated from this place, and be able to equip myself for the American expedition (which I do not relinquish) without encroaching on any friend.

"You have often kindly pressed me to let you know what would satisfy me for the two plans, MS. &c. connected with them. I really have never made a charge of this kind, and am at a loss how to calculate, much less to make a demand; but those who can perceive the labour, time, difficulties and contrivance, which the awkwardness of the ground created, may better be able to say, if L.250 for every thing, is unreasonable. At all events, it is not a charge, but I leave it to you; and in case you deem it extravagant, am ready to submit the whole to the valuation of any competent person. What regards the drawing, planning and superintending, Donovan, and the brass-cutter, in completing the two pieces of furniture, I am determined not to accept any thing for; these you must (forgive a strong word) do me the favour of accepting.

"Should Colonel K. not come to town, I shall feel greatly obliged by your assisting me with the above sum, in the course of a week. Pray favour me by calling on Mr. G. Tahourdin, in order to see the conditions of the assignment, which lays there, executed by me. He will also show you the Colonel's extraordinary letters, and all my answers; at least I imagine that he has, if not all, most of them.

"Could I in the course of seven or eight days (in addition to the L.250) procure about L.200, either from the Colonel or from you, on account of Colonel K's. L.1,500, for which you might hold the assignment as a security, I should be enabled to proceed immediately to the Tonnant; for I still think Lord Cochrane might obtain leave for my going on board, at all events; I yet have hopes, though his lordship seemed in doubt; perhaps you will obligingly urge his endeavours. I fear a much greater difficulty, for I have heard it hinted, that some creditors, fearful of my going to America (which I have too openly talked of), contemplate to lodge detainers against me. Among these however, Mr. Tahourdin is not; for I thought it my duty to tell him, and he handsomely consented to my endeavours against America, as the only means to recover from my many losses.

"My plan is to go on board, if possible, with a view to begin to drill the marines in rifle-shooting and exercise, and any of the crew in sword, pistol and pike use; if my creditors pursue me there, I could draw for the balance of L.900, to silence some of them (I mean after taking from L.1,500, L.200, to refund to you, in case you now oblige me with an advance, and L.400, to protect my securities for the rules); and if this cannot be completed with the Colonel time enough, and for which reason I flatter myself that you will assist me with your friendly interference, I see but one mode, that of going abroad the moment I find my creditors hostile; for although I may find L.350 to L.400, to pay the rules, I cannot find means in haste to satisfy the rest, although I have offered to assign considerable properties. In the latter case, might I not from abroad proceed to America, there to join the Admiral, as a volunteer, and at my own risk.

"Forgive my anxious and tedious suggestions, which your own feeling heart, and friendly interest in my future successes, have in some degree courted, and grant me your pardon for not attending to your good humoured hint about long letters. Even should you refuse my request, in regard to the L.200, I shall be thankful for your reply; but if it should convey your consent, the sum shall immediately be employed towards the honest but hazardous service of your country, although it hesitates by proper rank, and otherwise to encourage my loyal, and I trust zealous endeavours. Forgive the sound but frank style of this letter, owing to disappointments which would be intolerable, if the recollection of your kindness did not curb and relieve him, who must ever gratefully subscribe himself with unalterable esteem,

dear Sir, your faithful and obliged, humble servant, C. R. De Berenger."

To the Hon. Cochrane Johnstone, &c. &c. &c.

P.S. Apropos.—You have paid me L.50. on account;—may I trouble you to tender my most respectful assurances to Miss J.; that I hope most sincerely to hear that her indisposition discontinues. Should you no longer want the books, perhaps the bearer may bring them. Will lowness of spirits be received as an apology for this slovenly letter and crippled sheet?

Lord Ellenborough. This does not appear to have come by the twopenny post?

Mr. Park. No my Lord; but there is an indorsement upon it.

Lord Ellenborough. De Berenger was in the King's Bench; he had not servants to send with it?

Mr. Park. Yes, my Lord; it is sworn to by the Davidsons, that he had a man and a woman servant.

Lord Ellenborough. Probably he sent one of them, as you propose to call them, perhaps they may prove that.

Mr. Scarlett. There is a reference in that letter to an assignment of some property that De Berenger had?

A. Yes.

Q. Was such an assignment prepared at your office?

A. It was; it was an assignment from Mr. De Berenger to Colonel Kennedy.

Q. What was the subject of the assignment?

A. It was an assignment of a share of a patent.

Mr. Gurney. We are getting so very wide of evidence, that I must object, which I am very loth to do.

Mr. Scarlett. There was something referred to, that might be a security to Mr. Johnstone.

Lord Ellenborough. That refers to something which is the real thing; that is all you can prove by this witness.

A. Yes, it does, my Lord.

Mr. Scarlett. Mr. Johnstone having written you that letter which has been read, to ask your opinion about De Berenger, did you state to him what was your opinion, as to his power of extricating himself?

A. I had some conversation with Mr. Johnstone, as I had had several times.

Q. In consequence of the letter which has just been read?

A. Yes; I replied to the letter shortly, and I had conversation with him in consequence.

Lord Ellenborough. Do you know whether Mr. Johnstone made any answer to the letter?

A. To the Baron? I really do not.

Mr. Scarlett. Is that your answer to Mr. Johnstone? (shewing a letter to the witness.)

A. Yes, it is.

Mr. Scarlett. If your Lordship will allow that to be read.

Lord Ellenborough. When did you write that?

A. I wrote that the 23d of February, the day after I received the letter.

Q. It is addressed to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone.

A. It was sent to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone.

Q. How came your answer to be in your hands?

Mr. Scarlett. It was handed over by us just now; it was given me by Mr. Cochrane Johnstone's attorney.

[The letter was read, as follows:]

"My dear Sir,

"In reply to your favour of yesterday, I beg to inform you, that the only sum I have paid the Baron on your account, since you advanced him the L.50, is a trifle of about L.7 or L.8, which he paid for the printing of the prospectus's of Vittoria. You are very kind in assisting him so much; I have done it till my purse is empty; but had it been otherwise, I would still have assisted him to the extent of my means, notwithstanding the little foolish difference between us.

"I will attend to your wishes respecting the annuities, I will settle with Dawson and Wrattislaw as speedily as possible.

"The Wendover business is proceeding; but I am awkwardly circumstanced, not having all the documents before me; in Lady M. L. Crawford's business I should wish to attend with you on the spot. Pray excuse haste

I am, dear sir, your's faithfully Gabl Tahourdin."

Temple, 23d Feb. 1814.

Lord Ellenborough. Where is the cover of this letter: the cover should be produced, for letters of this sort may be written after their date, and one wishes to have some external thing that cannot deceive; there is no post-mark to any of these letters.

Mr. Scarlett. Did you write that letter on the day of which it bears date?

A. Yes, I did; it was not sent by the post, I believe; I cannot charge my memory, whether it was or not?

Q. I see there is a lady alluded to, Lady Mary Crawford Lindsey; was she a tenant to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. No, she was not a tenant; she had purchased a house of his.

Q. There was a business to settle with her?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you know the fact, that in consequence of this correspondence which has been read, Mr. Johnstone did pay Mr. De Berenger any sum of money?

A. Only from the parties having acknowledged, the one the having paid it, and the other the having received it.

Q. You were not present when the money was paid?

A. No, I was not.

Q. Was there any receipt taken for the money?

A. Yes, there was.

Q. Did you take the receipt?

A. No, I did not.

Lord Ellenborough. Did you see it at the time of the receipt?

A. There were two receipts at the time.

Q. Do you know of its existence, by seeing it at the time when it purports to bear date?

A. A little afterwards; a few days afterwards.

Q. When did you first see it?

A. A few days afterwards; I really believe the L.50 receipt I handed myself to Mr. Johnstone, but I cannot charge my memory with it.

Lord Ellenborough. You saw it in the month of February, or when?

A. The L.50 receipt, which was in September or October, I believe I handed over to Mr. Johnstone myself; the other I did not.

Mr. Scarlett. When did you first see the other receipt; was it in February?

A. I think within two or three days after it was given.

Lord Ellenborough. Have you both the receipts there?

Mr. Scarlett. We have, my Lord.

Lord Ellenborough. Then hand them in, if he proves that he saw them about the date?

A. This receipt of the 20th of September 1813, I handed myself over to Mr. Johnstone.

[It was read, as follows.]

"London, Septr 20, 1813.

"Received of the Honble Cochrane Johnstone, the sum of fifty pounds (by the hands of Gabl Tahourdin, Esq.) on account of large plans, &c.

"C. Random De Berenger."

————— L.50 — — —————

Mr. Scarlett. You have another receipt in your hands, that bears date the 26th of February?

A. Yes.

Q. That money did not pass through your hands?

A. No.

Q. When did you first see that receipt?

A. In three or four days afterwards, when Mr. Johnstone called upon me; Mr. De Berenger and I were not at that time upon favourable terms; that will account for my not having delivered it over to him.

[It was read, as follows.]

"London, February the 26th, 1814.

"Received of the Honble A. Cochrane Johnstone, the sum of two hundred pounds, being the balance of some drawings, plans and prospecti, delivered.

"C. R. De Berenger."

—————- L.200 — — —————-

Mr. Scarlett. I observe, that in that correspondence there is mention made, besides the payment of L.250 of a loan of L.200?

A. Yes.

Q. Were you present at the passing of any money?

A. No, I was not.

Q. When did you first see that paper? (handing one to the witness.)

A. I saw it at the same time with the last receipt for L.200.

Q. What is it?

A. A note of hand for L.200.

Q. You saw that two or three days after it bears date?

A. Yes, I did.

[It was read as follows.]

L.200 — — —————- "London, February the 26th, 1814.

"Six Months after date, I promise to pay to the Honble A. Cochrane Johnstone, the sum of two hundred pounds.

"C. R. De Berenger."

Payable at Gabl Tahourdin, Esq. No 8, King's Bench Walk, Temple.

Mr. Scarlett. With respect to those letters you received from Mr. Johnstone, do they contain your indorsement upon the back of them?

A. I think they do.

Q. Is that your handwriting upon the back of that letter? (shewing it to the witness.)

A. It is.

Q. Was it written by you at the time you received it?

A. Yes.

Lord Ellenborough. What letter is that?

A. The letter of the Baron to Mr. Johnstone, of the 22d of February.

Lord Ellenborough. You wrote it on the same day?

A. I cannot say on the same day, but within a few days; when I doubled up the papers that lay on the table, with other documents.

Mr. Scarlett. Is it your habit, when you lay letters by, to endorse the date.

A. Yes, uniformly; but not on the day of receiving them; I let them lie till they accumulate unpleasantly.

Lord Ellenborough. If a man sends you letters enclosed from other persons, do you indorse the letters sent to you inclosed; that is no part of the correspondence with you?

A. No, it is not.

Q. Then I should apprehend, you would not usually do it?

A. I have done it differently; I have said "De Berenger to Johnstone."

Q. But you give it a date?

A. I have dated it above those words, as usual.

Q. When you receive a letter, you authenticate the period of receiving it, but not the date of a letter received by another.

A. I generally do; I enclose it in the letter to which it refers.

Mr. Scarlett. Was it so done in this instance?

A. It was.

Lord Ellenborough. Have you any letter-book?

A. I do not keep a letter-book; but I keep my letters very regularly tied up.

Mr. Scarlett. You have heard the contents of the letter from De Berenger to Mr. Johnstone read.

A. Yes.

Q. That refers to some documents in your hands, to serve as a security to Mr. Johnstone, in case he should require them?

A. Yes.

Q. Is it your usual practice, when letters of that sort are sent to you, to make the sort of endorsement you have done when you lay the letters by?

A. It is.

Lord Ellenborough. I only asked him as to the inclosure. If I received a letter, I should endorse the date of my receiving it as authenticating the fact; but I should not put the endorsement of the date upon the enclosure, for I know nothing of the date, whether it was received on that day or not; the gentlemen of the jury know whether that is the habit of business or not.

A Juryman. Is the date you have endorsed upon the enclosure, the date of your receiving it or the date of the letter?

A. The date of the letter.

Lord Ellenborough. Certainly it is not regular to authenticate the date of a letter, to which you are not privy; that is all my observation upon it.

Mr. Scarlett. Besides those plans you now produce, do you know whether there were other and subordinate plans drawn for the details of that same scheme?

A. Yes, there were.

[Examined by Mr. Park.]

Q. You have been a great while the attorney of Mr. De Berenger, and known to him?

A. Five or six years.

Q. Were you known to him before you were known to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you become security for the Rules for this gentleman before you knew Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. Some months.

Q. Then it was not at Mr. Cochrane Johnstone's desire that you became a surety for the Rules for this person?

A. Certainly not.

Q. Was Mr. Cochrane, who, I understand from Mr. Brushoft, was your co-surety, any relation of Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. No.

Lord Ellenborough. That has been proved over and over again; nobody made an observation upon it.

Mr. Park. I beg your Lordship's pardon; there could be no other motive, I conceive, in calling Mr. Brushoft.

Lord Ellenborough. I understood him to be called to prove, that Mr. Tahourdin was a surety for the defendant; I never heard an observation made upon Mr. Cochrane, as being a relation.

Mr. Park. Are you acquainted with the hand-writing of your client, Mr. De Berenger?

A. Perfectly.

Q. That letter, or those letters lying before his Lordship, which have been proved, I think you say they are his hand-writing?

A. There is only one.

Q. Have you ever seen that letter before you saw it yesterday? (handing to the witness the letter sent to Admiral Foley.)

A. Never; I just saw it yesterday, and that was all.

Q. Upon the knowledge you have of the hand-writing of Mr. De Berenger, is that, in your judgment, the hand-writing of Mr. De Berenger or not?

A. Certainly not.

Lord Ellenborough. Be upon your guard.

Mr. Park. Be upon your guard, and look at it attentively. You have many times seen and read his letters?

A. A thousand times, and received a thousand letters from him.

Q. And you do not believe it to be his hand-writing?

A. I do not indeed; it is not his hand-writing.

Lord Ellenborough. That is the Dover letter?

Mr. Park. Yes it is, my Lord. If your Lordship will look at that and the other letter, you will see a marked difference.

[The witness compared the two letters.]

Lord Ellenborough. The gentleman may look at the two letters; but that furnishes no argument, for a person would certainly write a disguised hand at that time, if ever he did in his life. This gentleman does not go on belief that it is not, but he swears positively that it is not his hand-writing.

Mr. Park. Certainly, my Lord; and there is, on the other side, only Mr. Lavie. This gentleman having seen Mr. De Berenger write a thousand times, and received a thousand letters from him. Do you, in your judgment and conscience believe, that that is a disguised hand of Mr. De Berenger?

A. I do not.

A Juryman. Why did you take the two letters up to compare the two hand-writings, if you had no doubt in your mind?

A. I had no doubt at all of it.

Lord Ellenborough. Why did you compare the two then?

A. I wished to be circumspect; but if my life rested upon it, I should say, this is not his hand-writing, according to my belief and judgment.

Mr. Park. What has been, for the number of years you have known this person, his general character?

A. I have always considered him a man of strict honour and integrity.

Q. We have heard he has been in difficulties?

A. He has been.

Q. And he is a debtor of yours?

A. Yes, he is a very large one.

Q. To what amount have you trusted him?

A. To the extent, I believe, of about L.4,000, and upwards, besides my professional claim.

Lord Ellenborough. In money.

A. Yes, in money.

Mr. Gurney. I only want to ask Mr. Wood as to this road book. I believe it has been identified before.

Lord Ellenborough. That was put in yesterday.

Mr. Jones. I had it yesterday in my hands; it was put in by Mr. Wood.

Mr. Gurney. I wish to shew Mr. Tahourdin the hand-writing in that book.

Lord Ellenborough. The hand-writing in that road book certainly was as extremely like the Dover letter as ever I saw any thing in my life. [The road book was handed to Mr. Tahourdin.]

Cross-examined by Mr. Gurney.

A. Have the goodness to look at that pencil-writing in that road book; do you believe it to be Mr. De Berenger's hand-writing.

Lord Ellenborough. Now be upon your guard.

Mr. Gurney. Look at both pages.

[The witness examined it.]

A. Some of it appears to be more like his hand-writing than the other part.

Q. Do not you believe it all to be his hand-writing?

A. No, I do not indeed.

Q. How much of it do you believe to be his hand-writing.

Lord Ellenborough. State the parts where you think the likeness ends, and where you think somebody else has taken up the pencil and written a part of it.

A. That looks more like his hand-writing [pointing it out] but it is not the general writing of Mr. De Berenger.

Mr. Gurney. How much of it do you believe to be his writing?

A. Some part of it looks more like his writing than other part.

Q. Is there any part which you believe is not?

A. The writing part is not at all like his writing.

Q. I ask you as to nothing but the writing part?

A. Some are figures.

Q. Looking at those two pages, you say it is not all his hand-writing?

A. No, I do not think I did.

Q. That was your first answer?

Lord Ellenborough. You said "There is some more like his hand-writing, but I do not believe it all is."

Mr. Gurney. How much is there of it that you do not believe to be his writing.

A. Some of the letters look like his hand-writing.

Q. How much or how little of it do you think to be his hand-writing?

A. The smaller parts look like his hand-writing.

Q. Now I ask you upon your oath, have you any doubt of the whole of those two pages having been written by the same hand?

A. Upon my word it is difficult to say.

Q. Not at all so; I have looked at it attentively, and I know it is not difficult to say; do not you believe it all written by the same hand?

[The witness examined it again.]

Lord Ellenborough. You can say whether you believe it to be De Berenger's hand-writing?

A. Upon my word, I really do not know what to say.

Mr. Gurney. I am quite content with that answer?

Lord Ellenborough. Mr. Park, would you like to look the Dover letter?

Mr. Park. I am no judge of hand-writing, my Lord.

Lord Ellenborough. That may be a concealed hand-writing, and I should think it extremely likely.

Mr. Park. I mean to call other witnesses to this; I have nothing to conceal in this case?

Lord Ellenborough. No; you announced to us that you flatly contradict the whole of the story as to Mr. De Berenger.

Mr. Park. Yes, I do my Lord; I observe this is all pencilling which has been shewn to you?

A. Yes, it is.

Mr. Park. Is this pencil writing in the same kind of character that a man writes when he writes with pen and ink; are you enabled to say from your knowledge of the hand-writing, whether it is or is not?

A. That it is which puzzles me more than any thing, its being in pencil.

A Juryman. We should like to see that road book.

Mr. Park. Does your Lordship think the jury have a right to see that; they cannot take it for the purpose of comparing with any thing else?

Lord Ellenborough. It is in evidence, being found in the desk of the defendant, they may look at each, if they please.

General Campbell, sworn.

Examined by Mr. Brougham.

Q. Do you know Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. I do.

Q. Did you meet him in the month of September or October last, at a meeting or hunt in Scotland?

A. I met him the second week, I think in last October, at the Perth meeting.

Q. Did he at that time shew you some plans and prospectus of the new place of amusement, in the nature of a Ranelagh?

A. I saw in Mr. Cochrane Johnstone's hands, the prospectus of a new public place, he called it, to be erected in the Regent's Park, or the neighbourhood of the Regent's Park.

Q. Do you recollect the name he gave to it?

A. I think he called it Vittoria.

Q. Will you look at the prospectus, and see whether that is the same? [The prospectus was shewn to the witness.]

A. I believe this is a copy of the same that I saw.

Q. Look at the plan?

A. He did not shew me the plan.

Q. Did he shew this prospectus, and communicate to other persons at that meeting upon the subject of it, as well as you?

A. I cannot speak to that; he communicated to me in my own apartment or his own, I cannot recollect which.

[Mr. Hopper was called, but did not answer.]

Mr. Serjeant Best. This gentleman was taken very ill, being kept here last night; if he comes by and by, I trust your Lordship will permit him to be examined out of his turn.

Lord Ellenborough. Certainly, at any period.

Mr. Serjeant Best. That is the case of the three defendants for whom I appear.

The Right Honourable the Earl of Yarmouth sworn.

Examined by Mr. Park.

Q. You are I believe, or were, the Colonel of the Duke of Cumberland's sharp-shooters?

A. Lieutenant-colonel commandant.

Q. It is called the corps of sharp-shooters?

A. Yes.

Q. Captain De Berenger was adjutant of that regiment, was he not?

A. He was a non-commissioned officer, acting adjutant.

Q. How long have you known Mr. De Berenger?

A. Ever since a few days after I was elected to command that corps; that was in the beginning of the year 1811; I cannot fix the day, very early in that year I know it was.

Q. Has your Lordship had opportunities of seeing Mr. De Berenger write, or of receiving letters from him, and of acting upon those letters from him.

A. I have received a great many letters from him, and have seen him write occasionally.

Q. And you have seen him, probably, on the subject of the contents of those letters?

A. Very frequently; two or three times I have seen him alter the regimental orders, and have received very many letters from him.

Q. Are you, from that opportunity that you have described, in a capacity to state to his Lordship and the jury, whether you are acquainted with his character of hand-writing?

A. As well as I am with that of any other gentleman with whom I have been in the habit of correspondence.

Q. Then, not knowing what your Lordship's answer may be, I will trouble your Lordship to look at that.—[The letter sent to Admiral Foley was handed to his Lordship.]

A. I will read it through, if you please.—[His lordship read the letter.]

Q. Supposing you had heard none of the circumstances which this trial has brought to every body's ears, and of which your Lordship has heard so much yesterday; from the character of the hand-writing of Mr. De Berenger, should you have believed it to be his hand-writing?

A. Certainly not.

Q. Your lordship, I believe, knows that in the month of July, this gentleman was very urgent and solicitous to go out as a sharp-shooter to America, with Sir Alexander and afterwards with Lord Cochrane?

A. He mentioned to me one day, when he came to me on the business of the corps——

Q. Was that in January?

A. I think so; but I cannot swear to the date; he mentioned to me, that he had very nearly arranged to go out, to drill the crew and the marines on board of the Tonnant. I thought he mentioned it in a way to suggest, that he wished some little additional influence, and I got rid of the thing.

Cross-examined by Mr. Gurney.

Q. The writing of that is larger than Mr. De Berenger usually writes?

A. Certainly, it is longer.

Q. The character of the letters is longer?

A. Oh, certainly; it is a very round small hand he generally writes, and a very pretty hand.

Q. Will your lordship look at that letter, and tell me, whether you received that letter at or about the time that it bears date? (shewing a letter to his lordship.)

A. Yes; either the day it bears date, or the day immediately after it.

Mr. Gurney. I request Mr. Law will mark that letter; the date of it is March the 19th?

A. I believe I marked the cover.

Q. Will your lordship have the goodness to look at the hand-writing in that road book (shewing it to his lordship); that I believe is larger than Mr. De Berenger's usual writing, is it not?

A. I think it is; some part certainly does not look larger; it is less round—it is more angular.

Q. Does your lordship or not, believe that to be Mr. De Berenger's hand-writing?

A. I am not sufficiently conversant with hand-writing, to wish to swear to an opinion either way.

Re-examined by Mr. Park.

Q. That is in pencil?

A. Yes.

Q. With respect to the letter in question, although it is of a larger description than Mr. De Berenger's usual writing, does it appear to your lordship to be at all a feigned hand, as disguising the real hand?

A. Another question to which I am not competent to give an answer; if I was to look through the letter—there is one letter which creates a suspicion, but I should never have suspected it on a cursory view of the letter; it is the letter R before Du Bourg, but that I should have never looked at or suspected; that looks more like his hand-writing than any other part; it looks like the way in which he makes the R of Random.

Q. Does your lordship mean the large capital R, or the little r?

A. The large capital R is the only letter I can see that looks in the least like his hand.

Q. Your judgment upon that letter, upon the whole inspection of it, is, that it is not his hand-writing?

A. I should never suspect it, except from that letter.

Lord Ellenborough. It is a larger character?

A. Yes, it is a fuller character.

Q. It is a stiffer character, and more upright?

A. It is less upright, I think, than his; it is more angular and longer.

Lord Ellenborough. That is his usual writing, is it not? (shewing another letter to the witness.)

A. Oh, yes; certainly, I am perfectly familiar with that.

Lord Ellenborough. You are certainly borne out in your observation upon the letter; look at that letter R again?

A. It struck me on reading the letter.

Q. In what manner an artificial letter may be written, so as to disable a person from saying whether it is the hand-writing of a certain person, you cannot say?

A. I am perfectly incompetent, as I informed your lordship and the jury before, to give any judgment upon that.

Q. What is the uniform of your corps?

A. The uniform is, the waistcoat green, with a crimson cape.

Q. A bottle green, is it not?

A. Some have got it a little darker than others, but it should be a deep bottle-green with a crimson collar; the great coat is a waistcoat with black fur round it, consequently no crimson collar.

Q. The body in your uniform is not red?

A. It is deep bottle green.

A Juryman. A jacket or coat?

A. It is a waistcoat, very like the light-horse uniform.

Lord Ellenborough. It is almost unnecessary to ask you, whether the members of your corps wear any decorations; a star or a cross?

A. When in uniform, some wear medals that they have gained as prizes given by the corps; they occasionally wear them hanging by a ribband.

Q. You wear no such decorations as this? (shewing the star to his lordship.)

A. No, certainly not.

Q. Supposing a gentleman appeared before you in an aid-de-camp's uniform, with that star upon his breast, and that other ornament appendant, should you consider that was a man exhibiting himself in the dress of your sharp-shooting corps?

A. Certainly not.

Q. If a sharp-shooter belonging to your corps presented himself to you in that dress, you would think it a very impertinent thing?

A. Certainly.

Mr. Serjeant Best. As Lord Yarmouth has been called by the defendant, De Berenger, and has given evidence which may affect Lord Cochrane, we conceive, we submit we have a right to make an observation upon it.

A Juryman. If Colonel De Berenger had appeared before your lordship in the uniform of his corps, would it have been any thing extraordinary?

A. Nothing extraordinary; it would have been more military that he should do so, though I never exacted it.

Captain Sir John Poo Beresford, sworn.

Examined by Mr. Richardson.

Q. Are you acquainted with Mr. De Berenger?

A. I have seen him twice in my life before yesterday.

Q. Have you had any occasion to see him write, or to be acquainted with the character of his hand-writing?

A. Never.

Q. Do you know at any time in the early part of this year, or the latter end of the last, of any applications he was making to go to America as a sharp-shooter?

A. I will tell you the part I took in reference to that business. In the beginning of February, I paid my ship off; after that, I met Mr. Cochrane Johnstone in town, who told me Sir Alexander Cochrane was very anxious he should go out in the Tonnant, to teach the marines the rifle-exercise. I went to the Horse Guards to ask whether anything could be done; I was told it would be useless to apply to the Duke of York; and I told Mr. Cochrane Johnstone of it the day after. I was dressing before breakfast, and Mr. De Berenger sent up to say, that he was very much obliged to me for the part I had taken.

Q. At what time was this?

A. I think, the beginning of February; but before Sir Alexander Cochrane sailed, I met him at Mr. Cochrane Johnstone's, with Admiral Hope and some ladies; I think that was in January, or the latter end of December; there were, I think, fourteen of us, some of them ladies. This application was after he had sailed. When I went to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone's, I was to have met Sir Alexander Cochrane, but he went to dine somewhere else, and my Lord Cochrane came in after dinner; he did not dine there, but a great many of the family did.

James Stokes sworn.

Examined by Mr. Park.

Q. I understand you are a clerk of Mr. Tahourdin, the attorney.

A. Yes.

Q. How long have you been so?

A. Between three and four years.

Q. Have you, in the course of those three or four years, had frequent opportunities of seeing the hand-writing of Mr. De Berenger?

A. Daily.

Q. He has been a client of your master, and has been assisted very much by him?

A. Yes.

Q. Have you seen him write, as well as seeing letters purporting to come from him?

A. A great deal.

Q. Be so good as to look at that paper (the Dover letter), and tell his lordship and the jury, whether in your judgment and belief, that is the hand-writing of Mr. De Berenger?

A. Certainly not.

Q. Look at that, and say whether you think it is a feigned hand, but still the hand-writing of De Berenger?

A. It certainly is not.

Q. Of course, a man can only speak to belief and judgment when he does not see a thing written; do you believe, from your knowledge of his hand-writing, that that is his writing, either feigned or real?

A. Not a word of it.

Lord Ellenborough. Look at the letter R in the signature?

A. It is not like it at all.

Mr. Park. I mean the large R.

A. The capital R is nothing like it.

Mr. Park. It is a singular R certainly, it looks as if it had been intended for a P and made into an R.

Lord Ellenborough. It is not at all like that R, is it? [shewing another letter to the witness.]

A. No, I do not think it is any thing like that.

William Smith sworn.

Examined by Mr. Richardson.

Q. You are servant to Mr. De Berenger?

A. Yes.

Q. How long have you been his servant?

A. About three years and a half.

Q. Do you write yourself?

A. Yes.

Q. During the time you have been in his service, have you seen him write, and become acquainted with his hand-writing.

A. A great deal of it.

Q. Is he a gentleman who writes a good deal?

A. Yes.

Q. Are you well acquainted with the character of his hand-writing?

A. Yes.

Q. Have the goodness to look that over, and then I will ask you a question respecting it, and among other things look at the signature at the bottom, R. Du Bourg.—[The letter sent to Admiral Foley was handed to the witness, and he examined it.]

Mr. Park. Having examined that paper, is that, in your judgment and belief, the hand-writing of your master, Mr. De Berenger?

A. I really believe it is not.

Q. The whole, or any part of it.

A. None of it.

Q. Have you any doubt of that?

A. I am positively sure it is not his hand-writing.

Q. According to the best of your judgment and belief?

A. According to the best of my judgment and belief.

Q. You have been his servant three years and a half?

A. Yes.

Q. We understand he has lately lodged with a person of the name of Davidson, in a place called the Asylum Buildings.

A. Yes.

Q. Were you with him till he went away in the month of February?

A. Yes.

Q. That was on Sunday the 27th, was it not?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you remember, whether he was at home on the Sunday preceding that, that would be the 20th?

A. I perfectly remember it.

Q. Did he sleep at home on the Saturday night?

A. He did.

Q. Did he go out at any time on Sunday morning?

A. He did.

Q. Do you remember at what time?

A. About nine o'clock.

Q. Did he come in again after that?

A. Yes.

Q. And go out again?

A. Yes.

Q. About what time was that.

A. It was near eleven when he came home, and he went out immediately afterwards; he was not above a quarter of an hour or twenty minutes before he returned again.

Q. Did he return again after that?

A. Yes.

Q. How soon after?

A. About twenty minutes.

Q. Would that be after persons were gone to church that he returned?

A. Yes.

Q. How long did he stay at home then?

A. Till about four o'clock.

Q. He went out again about four o'clock?

A. Yes.

Q. Were you at home at the time he went out again, about four o'clock?

A. I was over the way.

Q. Did you see him?

A. Yes; I had the dogs out, and was leaning with my back against the rail when he came down.

Q. Your master's dogs?

A. Yes.

Q. He kept dogs, did he?

A. Only one; one was mine; I was with them opposite, on the other side of the road, leaning against the rail facing the door.

Q. What were you doing with the dogs?

A. I generally take them out for occasions.

Q. Did you see him go out about that time?

A. I did.

Q. Did you yourself go out soon after that?

A. Yes I did, and my wife.

Q. About what time did you return home that evening?

A. About eleven o'clock, within a few minutes of eleven.

Q. Was your master at home when you returned or not?

A. He was not at home.

Q. Did he come home afterwards?

A. Yes.

Q. About what time?

A. I had not been at home, I suppose five minutes, before my master came home.

Q. That would be a few minutes before or after eleven?

A. Yes.

Q. Did he sleep at home that night.

A. Yes.

Q. What means have you of knowing that?

A. The means I have were these; after I came home we were down in the kitchen taking our supper, my master was in the drawing-room before we had got to bed, I heard him going up stairs to his bed-room, he passed my room door; that was not above half past eleven.

Q. Did he breakfast at home the next morning, or not.

A. No, he did not.

Q. Did you see him the next morning early?

A. No.

Q. About what time did you see him the next day?

A. About three o'clock; I cannot speak to a minute or two.

Q. Did you hear or see him go out?

A. I did not.

Q. You saw him about three o'clock on the Monday?

A. Yes, I did.

Q. Who made his bed?

A. My wife.

Cross-examined by Mr. Gurney.

Q. Did you let him in?

A. Yes.

Q. You opened the door to him?

A. Yes.

Q. At a little after eleven, that night?

A. Yes, thereabouts, it might be a little before, or a little after.

Q. He gave a good loud knock at the door, in his usual way?

A. He rapped as usual.

Q. And his usual rap was a loud one?

A. Not over loud.

Q. Not very gentle?

A. Between.

Q. Between loud and gentle?

A. Yes.

Q. And he slept at home that night?

A. I cannot say that he slept, he went to his bed-room, and the bed when I went in the morning looked as if he had slept in it.

Q. Did you see him in bed the next morning?

A. No, I did not, I heard him go into the bed room.

Q. You did not see him the next day till three o'clock?

A. No.

Q. Did you write that letter to Lord Yarmouth? (shewing a letter to the witness.)

A. I did.

Q. Of your own head?

A. Yes.

Q. No body furnished you with any draught to write from?

A. No.

Q. Have you your master's military great coat here?

A. Yes.

Q. His military grey great coat?

A. Yes; not in this present place.

Q. It is at Guildhall?

A. Yes.

Q. Now attend to this question, have you not acknowledged that your master slept from home that night?

A. Never.

Q. Have you not acknowledged it to Mr. Murray?

A. Never.

Q. I give you notice he is here?

A. I know he is.

Q. Now I ask you, did you not on Monday the 21st, tell Mr. or Mrs. Davidson, or both, that coming home, and not finding your master at home, you had left the key for him at the usual place in the area, that he might let himself in?

A. I did not tell them so, upon my oath.

Q. Neither of them?

A. No, neither of them.

Q. Did you tell Mr. or Mrs. Davidson that on any other day; did you ever tell them so?

A. No, not to the best of my knowledge.

Q. To the best of your knowledge?

A. I never told them so.

Q. As you did not attend your master on the Monday morning, who attended him and brought him his shaving things, and gave him the usual attendance of a gentleman?

A. He never has any attendance; I never go to his bed room till about half past eight, and sometimes he is up, and sometimes not.

Q. Do you mean to say, he is a gentleman that wants no attendance?

A. Yes; he cleans his teeth, and washes himself and powders his hair, without my being in his bed room.

Q. He does not usually ring his bell in a morning, I suppose, doing without attendance?

A. Not before he comes down to breakfast.

Q. What time does he usually come down to breakfast?

A. At different hours.

Q. What is his usual hour?

A. Sometimes nine, sometimes ten, sometimes eight.

Q. Till he comes down, he does not ring for you?

A. Very seldom.

Q. He is a very quiet, a remarkably quiet man in his lodging?

A. I never knew him to be otherwise.

Q. Not a person walking about, or making a noise of any kind?

A. Not making any disturbance; he walks about very much.

Q. Your master finally left his lodgings on Sunday the 27th.

A. Yes.

Q. Do you remember your paying or changing a fifty-pound note with a Mr. Seeks?

A. I do.

Q. From whom did you receive that fifty-pound note?

A. Mr. De Berenger.

Q. On what day did you receive that?

A. On the 27th, I think it was.

Q. On the Sunday?

A. Yes; I think it was.

Q. The day he went away?

A. Yes; I think it was.

Q. When he went away, he took his things to the Angel Inn, St. Clements.

A. I took them for him.

Q. For him to go into the country?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you receive no more than fifty pounds from him; did you not also receive a twenty pound from him?

A. I did not; not the same day.

Q. What day did you receive that twenty pounds?

A. I cannot positively say.

Q. Was it a day or two before he went away?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you receive also a two pound from him?

A. I do not recollect.

Q. Did you receive and give to any person, of the name of Sophia, thirteen pounds from him?

A. No; I gave none to Sophia.

Q. Did you see him give her any thing?

A. No, I did not; if I was in the room I did not notice it.

Q. Do you know any person of the name of Hebden, or Heberdine?

A. No.

Q. Do you remember, the day before your master finally went away, Mr. Cochrane Johnstone calling with a letter?

A. I do not remember that; I was not at home.

Q. Upon your oath, did not a gentleman call there, who you told Mr. Davidson was Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. Upon my oath I was not at home; she told me a gentleman called there, and giving a description of him, I said, most likely it was Mr. Cochrane Johnstone.

Q. You knew Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. Very little.

Q. But you did know him?

A. I once saw him.

Q. Did you not tell her on the Sunday, that if your master had been at home on the Saturday, when Mr. Cochrane Johnstone brought that letter, he would have gone off on the Saturday night?

A. I did not.

Q. Did you not on the Saturday or the Sunday?

A. I did not.

Q. Was your master at home all that week, from the 20th to the 27th?

A. He was not always at home.

Q. He was at home every day?

A. Yes.

Q. Going out as usual?

A. Yes.

Q. On the 21st, for instance?

A. The 21st he went out to dine.

Q. Where did he go to?

A. I cannot positively say.

Q. Did he tell you where he was going to?

A. I do not recollect.

Q. Upon your oath, did he not tell you he had been to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone's?

A. No.

Q. You swear that?

A. Yes.

Q. Nor that he was going there?

A. No.

Q. When you came home on the Monday, did you see any black coat in the room?

A. I did.

Q. Was that your master's black coat, or a strange black coat?

A. A strange black coat.

Q. That black coat must have fitted your master vastly well?

A. I cannot say, I never saw it on.

Q. You brushed it, did not you?

A. Yes; but not on his back.

Q. You are used to brushing his coats?

A. Of course.

Q. Now, a servant used to brush his master's coat, must know the size pretty well; this would be rather a short coat upon him, would it not?

A. No; I do not think it would.

Q. Upon your oath, would it not have been a great deal too long; was not it the coat of a man six feet high?

A. I did not know who owned the coat.

Q. I did not ask you that; but was not that the coat of a gentleman six feet high?

A. I do not know.

Q. You are not competent to say what sized man that would fit?

A. That coat would fit me very well; it is rather wide.

Q. Not at all too long for you?

A. No, not at all.

Q. You have seen Lord Cochrane, have not you?

A. Never in my life, to my knowledge.

Q. You have sworn some affidavits, have you not?

A. I have.

Q. Did you draw them yourself?

A. I did.

Q. Without any assistance?

A. Without any assistance.

Q. Whom had you seen before you drew them?

A. I cannot say who I saw, thousands.

Q. Upon that business?

A. No body.

Q. Before you made that affidavit, you had not seen any body upon that business?

A. No.

Q. Not Lord Cochrane?

A. Never in my life.

Q. Nor Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. No.

Q. Nor Mr. Tahourdin?

A. I saw Mr. Tahourdin, but he did not know of my making the affidavits; I told Mr. Tahourdin of my master's absence; I went to tell him.

Q. How soon was that after he left his lodgings?

A. I cannot positively say to a day.

Lord Ellenborough. What absence do you mean?

A. From the 27th.

Mr. Gurney. How soon after the 27th did you tell him?

A. About the 7th or 8th.

Q. Of March?

A. Yes.

Q. You swore your affidavit on the 24th of March?

A. Yes; but I drew it out before then.

Q. And that without any concert with any body whatever?

A. Yes.

Q. Merely for the vindication of your master's character?

A. Yes.

Q. And when you had done it, what did you do with the affidavit?

A. I sent it to have it published.

Q. To whom did you send it?

A. I took it to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone. I found my master a very injured gentleman.

Q. And therefore you took it to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone, to be published?

A. I did not take it to be published.

Q. You gave me those very words?

A. He did publish it.

Q. Did you not take it to be published?

A. I did not take it to the printer.

Q. Did you not take it to Mr. Cochrane Johnstone, that it might be published?

A. Yes.

A Juryman. Did your master breakfast at home on Monday the 21st of February?

A. No, he did not.

Re-examined by Mr. Richardson.

Q. When was it that you first saw this black coat?

A. On the 21st of February.

Q. That was the Monday?

A. Yes.

Q. That was after he came home, which you say was about three o'clock?

A. I came home about three o'clock.

Q. He was at home?

A. Yes.

Q. He might have been at home before that?

A. Yes, he might.

Q. Does your master play on any musical instrument?

A. He was used to do.

Lord Ellenborough. I will ask any question upon that subject for you, but there has been no question put on the cross-examination with reference to it?

Mr. Park. There was a question about his being still.

Lord Ellenborough. There was no allusion to musical instruments; you should have gone through it in your original examination, as it was to contradict their case. Does your master play on any musical instrument?

A. Yes; both the bugle-horn and violin.

Q. You say Mrs. Davidson described to you a person who called, and that you said it was most likely Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. Yes.

Q. You had seen Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. Yes; I had seen him but once.

Q. This was on Saturday the 26th?

A. Yes.

Q. Why did you say it was most likely Mr. Cochrane Johnstone?

A. Because she told me it was a tall gentleman, and his long hair very much powdered.

Q. Having seen him but once, and not being much acquainted with him, what led you to say most likely it was Mr. Cochrane Johnstone; had you any expectation that he would come that day?

A. No, not the least.

Q. But having seen him once, you thought it must be that tall man and powdered, whom you had seen but once in your life?

Q. I might have seen him oftener than that, but not to my recollection.

Q. What you said was, that you had seen him once?

A. I had seen him once, I know.

Q. Had you seen him oftener than that?

A. I cannot say; but I once saw him at his own house.

Q. I supposed you had never seen him but once from your answer?

A. I might have seen him oftener, but I do not know that I had.

Q. You are as sure as that you are existing, that your master went up at eleven o'clock, or sometime after eleven, on Sunday evening the 20th of February?

A. So help me God; I am sure he did.

A Juryman. Did you see him go up, or only hear him go up?

A. I heard him go up; I was in my bed room.

Lord Ellenborough. But you let him in?

A. Yes, I did.

A Juryman. You are sure that was on Sunday the 20th?

A. Yes.

Q. Did your master often breakfast out?

A. Sometimes.

Q. Not often.

A. Not very often.

Ann Smith sworn.

Examined by Mr. Park.

Q. Are you the wife of Charles Smith?

A. Of William Smith.

Q. Were you a servant, with your husband, of Mr. De Berenger, in February last?

A. Yes.

Q. Had you been so for any length of time?

A. Two years and a half.

Q. Do you recollect having seen him at home on Sunday the 20th of February?

A. Yes.

Q. In the forenoon?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you know what time he went out that morning?

A. About nine o'clock.

Q. When did he come in again?

A. Between ten and eleven o'clock.

Q. How long did he stay at home at that time?

A. Not a great while.

Q. He then went out again?

A. Yes.

Q. When did you see him again?

A. He did not stay long.

Q. When did you and your husband go out that day?

A. Between four and five, after my master was gone out.

Q. What time did he go out?

A. About four o'clock.

Q. And you and your husband went out between four and five o'clock.

A. Yes.

Q. At what time did you and your husband return home that night?

A. About eleven, as near as I can guess.

Q. Was your master come home before you, or did he not return till afterwards?

A. My husband came in a few minutes before my master, and went down to strike a light, and I stopped to bring him some beer.

Q. Did your husband and you come home together?

A. Yes; only that I called at the public house for some beer; my husband said he would go in, and strike a light.

Q. Did your master come in that evening?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you see him come in?

A. No, he was let in before I returned with the beer.

Q. You heard him up stairs?

A. Yes.

Q. Is it your custom yourself to see him in the evening; does he sup?

A. He takes a little supper, but I was never in the habit of carrying it up stairs.

Q. Your husband does that?

A. Yes.

Q. Did he carry it up that evening?

A. He had nothing but a bit of bread, and a glass of ale.

Q. You did not see him that night?

A. No.

Q. Was it your business, as the female servant of this gentleman, to make his bed?

A. Yes.

Q. At what time did you get up on the Monday morning?

A. About seven.

Q. Are you sure that the time we are speaking of, was the Sunday morning before he finally went off?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you usually get up about seven?

A. Yes.

Q. At what time did your master go out that morning?

A. He went out before breakfast.

Q. At what hour do you take that to be?

A. Before Smith went out; he went out about eight and my master went out a little before him.

Lord Ellenborough. Did you see him go out?

A. No.

Mr. Park. Did you hear him?

A. No, I did not know that he was out, till I let him in.

Lord Ellenborough. You did not know that he had been at all absent from home on Monday, till you let him in?

A. No.

Mr. Park. Had you made the bed on the Sunday, the day you saw him go out so many times in the morning?

A. Yes, I was up stairs making the bed, and he went out; I looked out of the window, and saw him go.

Q. Did you, or not, make his bed on the Monday?

A. I did.

Q. At what time of the day did you make his bed?

A. Not till after my master came home; my master came home, and when I found he had been out, I went up stairs immediately, and I made his bed.

Q. As you did not see your master on the Sunday night or Monday morning, what was the last time upon the Sunday that you did in fact see him; not that you believe him to be there, but that you saw him with your own eyes?

A. I am not certain whether I saw him go out on the Sunday at four o'clock, but I think I did.

Q. You say you made his bed after he came home on the Monday?

A. Yes.

Q. You let him in on the Monday, at twelve o'clock?

A. Yes.

Q. Was the bed the same as it was to all appearance on other days?

A. Yes.

Lord Ellenborough. It appeared like a bed that had been slept in?

A. Yes.

Mr. Park. Had he been constantly sleeping in his own bed for several months?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you sleep in that bed, that night?

A. No.

Q. I did not mean to ask you an improper question; but you did not sleep in that bed; I meant no such insinuation as might be supposed?

A. I did not sleep in it.

Q. Did your husband sleep in that bed, and you in your own?

A. No.

Q. Did you and your husband sleep together that night?

A. Yes.

Q. Are you quite sure that you made the bed on the Sunday, and again on the Monday?

A. I did; I am quite sure of that.

Q. Do you recollect how your master was dressed when he came home on the Monday?

A. I do; he had a black coat on.

Q. Had he any thing in his hand?

A. Yes.

Q. What was it?

A. A bundle.

Q. Did you happen to see, while either it was in his hand, or immediately on his laying it down, the contents of the bundle?

A. I saw a part of a coat where the bundle was open at the tie; a grey coat, just where the knot was tied?

Q. Had your master a grey great coat?

A. Yes, he had.

Q. Had he had one for some time?

A. Yes; about a month, I believe.

Q. Did your master continue after that Monday to sleep regularly at home, till he finally went away on the following Sunday?

A. Yes.

Cross-examined by Mr. Bolland.

Q. Your master had no other servant but you and your husband?

A. No.

Q. In what capacity did he serve him?

A. As man-servant; he used to wait upon him, and do any thing that was requisite to do.

Q. He waited upon him at dinner?

A. Yes; and at breakfast; he always used to carry it up; I never did that, except when he was out.

Q. You did not know till your master came home, that he had been out that morning?

A. No, I did not.

Q. Your husband went out about eight o'clock.

A. Yes.

Q. Was not Mr. De Berenger in the habit of ringing his bell in the morning for breakfast?

A. After he came down he used to ring the drawing-room bell, and then I used to carry it up, if my husband was out.

Q. Who supplied him in the morning with water, for the purpose of shaving?

A. He never used warm water; he had water in his room.

Q. He never rang for your husband to attend him?

A. Sometimes he did; but he knew my husband was going out that morning, and therefore he did not ring.

Q. Did it not appear to you extraordinary that morning, that there was no call for breakfast till that hour?

A. Yes; I supposed my master had breakfasted out, of course, when he came in.

Q. But you did not know of his going out?

A. No.

Q. Was not your surprize excited by his not ringing?

A. Yes; I was rather surprized that he had not rang.

Q. Do you recollect how he was dressed on the Sunday when he went out last; you do not mean to say that you saw him go out at four o'clock?

A. I do not recollect.

Q. The last time when you saw him go out on Sunday, how was he dressed?

A. He had on a black coat and waistcoat, and grey overalls.

Q. Of course, not seeing him on the Monday, you did not know in what dress he went out that morning?

A. No.

Q. But you say he returned home in a black coat?

A. Yes.

Q. Was that black coat his own?

A. That I cannot say.

Q. Was not that coat much too long for your master?

A. I did not observe it.

Lord Ellenborough. He did not come home in the same black coat he had gone out in on the Sunday?

A. That I cannot tell; I was not in the habit of brushing his coat.

Mr. Bolland. Did you ever see Lord Cochrane?

A. No.

Q. Was not the coat that he came home in, on the Monday, so long, that you recollect remarking it could not belong to him?

A. No, I did not remark that.

Q. Did you see the coat lie on the chair afterwards?

A. It might be there, but I did not observe it.

Q. What was in this bundle that he brought home?

A. I saw a part of a grey coat between the tie of the bundle.

Q. Did you make an affidavit upon this business?

A. Yes.

Q. When was that?

A. The 24th of March.

Q. Who suggested to you the necessity of making the affidavit?

A. No body but my husband; it was his wish to make his, and he said, therefore Ann do you make yours.

Lord Ellenborough. What did you see besides the grey coat in the bundle?

A. I saw nothing but that.

Lord Ellenborough. Recollect yourself, because you have sworn you saw a green uniform?

A. There might be a green uniform.

Q. Was there, or was there not?

A. Yes, there was a green uniform.

Q. Was it in the bundle or not?

A. Yes, it was in the bundle.

Mr. Bolland. Was there any thing extraordinary in your master going out in his green drill dress?

A. No; not that I know of.

Q. Was he in the habit of going out in it?

A. Yes.

Q. And of returning in it?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you ever know him go out in his green drill dress and come home in a black coat?

A. No.

Q. That morning he had his green drill dress in his bundle, with his great coat?

A. Yes.

Q. Your husband made an affidavit, and you made an affidavit as well yourself?

A. Yes.

Q. Had you seen any body on the subject of that affidavit?

A. No.

Q. Had you seen Mr. Tahourdin?

A. No.

Q. How soon after or before making that affidavit, did you see Mr. Tahourdin?

A. I saw Mr. Tahourdin a few days after.

Q. Did you know for what purpose your affidavit was made; how it was to be used?

A. No.

Q. Do you know to whom it was taken; what did your husband do with it; do you know of your own knowledge?

A. It was put in the papers, I know.

Q. Was it put in by him or by any body else?

A. I believe it was put in by him.

Lord Ellenborough. Did Mr. De Berenger ever wear whiskers?

A. Yes, sometimes he used.

Q. How long before the 20th of February had you seen him wear whiskers?

A. I do not know; I was so little in the habit of seeing my master, that I do not know whether he had whiskers or not.

Q. You saw him come in at the door, did not you?

A. On the Monday morning.

Q. At times you used to see him?

A. Yes.

Q. Were you so little acquainted with the countenance of the man in whose service you had lived two years and a half, that you did not know whether he was a whiskered man or an unwhiskered man?

A. I never attended the door when my husband was at home.

Q. You used to go backwards and forwards; just before you did not know whether there was a green coat in the bundle; and then when I put you in mind of what you had sworn, you say positively there was?

A. Yes, there was.

Q. And now you mean to say, you saw so little of your master, that you do not know whether he had whiskers?

A. No, I do not know.

A Juryman. You say you did not make your master's bed until his return on Monday?

A. No.

Q. Did you see it before his return on Monday?

A. No; but he was not up stairs, he was in the drawing room.

Q. You did not see the bed till after his return?

A. No, I did not.

John M'Guire, sworn;

Examined by Mr. Richardson.

Q. I believe you are ostler at Smith's livery stables, at the Cross Keys yard, Chelsea?

A. Yes.

Q. Were you acquainted with the person of Mr. De Berenger?

A. Yes.

Q. Was he in the habit of frequenting your master's stables, or that neighbourhood?

A. Yes.

Q. Were you well acquainted with his person in the month of February last?

A. Yes, I was.

Q. Do you remember seeing him upon the 20th of February?

A. Yes.

Q. On a Sunday?

A. Yes.

Q. What makes you remember the day?

A. I remember the day perfectly well, on the account that I knew him to be in the Rules of the King's Bench.

Q. How does that enable you to recollect the particular day?

A. Upon account, that I determined in my own mind, that I would ask his servant the next time I saw him, whether he was out of the Rules.

Q. Before that time had he ever lived at Chelsea?

A. Yes, he had.

Q. And so you became acquainted with his person?

A. Yes.

Q. On this 20th of February, at what time did you see him at Chelsea?

A. At a quarter past six.

Q. Where did you see him?

A. At Mr. Smith's stable-yard gateway.

A Juryman. A quarter past six in the morning or the evening?

A. The evening.

Mr. Park. Did any thing pass between you?

A. Yes; he asked me whether the coach was gone; I told him the six o'clock coach was gone, but the seven would be ready in three quarters of an hour.

Q. What further passed?

A. He made no more to do, but turned round and took his way to London.

Q. Did he say any thing more?

A. He said it would not do to wait for the seven o'clock coach.

Q. And he set out on foot for London?

A. He did.

Q. This was about a quarter past six, you say?

A. Yes.

Q. Are you confident as to the day?

A. I am.

Q. And as to his person, you have no doubt about it?

A. No, not the least.

Q. Did any circumstance occur to call this to your recollection?

A. Yes; I mentioned it to my wife, when I went home that night.

Q. What induced you to mention it to her?

A. That I had seen Mr. De Berenger on that evening, at a quarter past six.

Lord Ellenborough. You mentioned the time to her?

A. Yes.

Q. You mentioned particularly to her, that you had seen him at a quarter past six?

A. I did.

Mr. Richardson. What induced you to mention the circumstance to your wife?

A. Knowing that he was in the Rules of the Bench, and not having seen him that way, from the time that he was in the Rules before.

Q. Did he go from that lodging he had in Chelsea, to the Rules of the King's Bench?

A. Yes, he did.

Cross-examined by Mr. Adolphus.

Q. How long had you known Mr. De Berenger before this?

A. I had known him about three years and a half; I was living at Mr. Smith's yard at that time.

Q. And you had known him all that time?

A. I had.

Q. It was on the Sunday you saw him?

A. Yes.

Q. You knew him to be an officer in the corps of riflemen, did not you?

A. Yes, I did.

Q. Perhaps you thought he was out on Sunday on military duty, or something of that kind?

A. I did not know, but the answer my wife made, when I said that to her was, that she supposed it was the same as it was at Edinburgh, and that on the Sunday a person used to come and visit her aunt.

Q. I cannot see what makes you remember particularly that it was the 20th of February?

A. I had very good occasion for it.

Lord Ellenborough. Did you write it down?

A. No, I cannot write.

Q. Did your wife put it down?

A. No; she cannot write neither.

Mr. Adolphus. How do you know it was on the 20th of February?

A. I can swear that was the day; on that day fortnight I saw his servant, and that was the 6th of March, and I asked him, whether his master was out of the Rules of the Bench? and he said, he was not; and I said, I had seen him there; and he said, if he was there he did not know any thing of it, nor his master was not out of the Rules of the Bench.

Q. He said that he was at home, in the Bench, then?

A. No, that was not his meaning; that he was not got out of the Rules then, that he was not got clear of the Bench.

Q. The servant told you so on the 6th of March?

A. Yes.

Q. That he was not out of the Rules of the Bench?

A. Yes.

Q. That he was not on that day, the 6th of March?

A. Yes; that he did not know it if he was.

Q. He was quite surprised at hearing of it?

A. He did not seem in the least astonished, to me; I did not see him take any notice.

Q. He told you he was in the Rules of the Bench, and he did not see how he could come to Chelsea that day?

A. He told me he was not out of the Rules of the Bench, and if he came to Chelsea, he did not know it.

Q. It was by the conversation with the servant, you fix the date?

A. No, I knew the date.

Q. On what do you found your recollection that it was on that day?

A. I know that was the day.

Q. The 13th of February he was within the Rules of the Bench, and might have been at Chelsea?

A. No, it was not the 13th.

Q. How soon did you tell any body that you saw him on the 20th?

A. I told my wife that night.

Q. Your wife is here?

A. Yes, she is.

Q. How soon did you tell any body besides William Smith, the servant, any thing about him?

A. I told no body but William Smith, and my wife.

Q. Not to this moment?

A. Yes, I did, when I was sent for.

Q. When was that?

A. Last Monday week.

Q. Then you were seen by the attorney, and examined about this matter?

A. Yes.

Q. Was any body so particular as to ask you how this gentleman was dressed, when you saw him on this Sunday?

A. No.

Q. Now I am so particular; will you tell me how he was dressed?

A. He had a black coat, and black waistcoat, and grey pantaloons or overalls, but I will not say which.

Q. You have seen your old acquaintances, the two Smiths, here this morning?

A. I have seen one of them this morning.

Q. Which was that?

A. William, the servant.

Q. Had you any conversation with him about the dress on this Sunday?

A. No.

Q. You know Mr. De Berenger very well?

A. Yes.

Q. Did he wear whiskers on that Sunday?

A. No, he was close shaved upon that Sunday, I am certain.

Re-examined by Mr. Richardson.

Q. When you saw Mr. Smith, on the 6th of March, what question did you ask him?

A. I asked him, whether his master was out of the Rules of the Bench? that I had seen him on the Sunday fortnight, that he called at our yard, to know if the coach was gone; that I told him, the six o'clock coach was gone, but the seven o'clock coach would go in three quarters of an hour.

Q. You related the circumstance that had passed on the 20th of February, and then asked him, whether his master was out of the Rules of the King's Bench?

A. Yes.

Q. What did he answer?

A. That his master was not out of the Rules, and that if he was at Chelsea, it was more than he knew of.

Lord Ellenborough. You were struck with seeing him out of the Rules?

A. Yes.

Q. You thought it a very wrong thing of him?

A. Yes.

Q. And being shocked at it, you had a mind to enquire of his servant, whether he was within the Rules?

A. Yes.

Q. You did not say to him, Good God, Sir, how is it you are out of the Rules on this Sunday?

A. He did not stop to have any conversation.

Q. If he had stopped long enough, you would have told him so?

A. I do not know that I would.

Q. Where was he coming from, at a quarter past six?

A. He came up from the water-side; I cannot tell which way he came to the stable-yard gateway.

Q. And he seemed in a hurry to get home?

A. He did.

Q. How far is it from Asylum Place to Chelsea?

A. It is two miles from the bottom of our street to Buckingham-gate, and it is a mile from that to the middle arch of Westminster-bridge; I cannot tell how far it is from that to the Asylum.

Q. You did not see where he came from?

A. No.

Q. But he was in a hurry to get home?

A. Yes.

Mr. Park. It is three miles and a half, or four miles, my Lord.

A Juryman. Was it day-light or dark, when you saw him?

A. It was between the two lights; it was not very clear at that time.

Mr. Park. I will call this woman, and will put a question to her; I had not intended it, conceiving that what he said to his wife, could not be evidence.

Lord Ellenborough. You will call her, or not, as you see fit; I do not desire to have more persons called than is necessary.

Mr. Park. I must call her, as your Lordship has asked the question, what he told her?

Mr. Brougham. If your Lordship will permit us, we will examine Hopper now; he is extremely ill, I understand.

Lord Ellenborough. If you please.

Mr. Thomas Hopper sworn.

Examined by Mr. Brougham.

Q. What are you?

A. An architect.

Q. Do you know Mr. Cochrane Johnstone's premises at Allsop's buildings?

A. I saw them two nights ago.

Q. You saw a piece of ground that he possesses there?

A. I did.

Q. Will you look at that plan, which is lying there, for the laying out of the ground? (the witness looked at it.)

A. These plans I saw at the time.

Lord Ellenborough. That is two nights ago?

A. Yes, it is.

Mr. Brougham. Did you at the same time see the prospectus of the plan for laying out the place?

A. This, I believe, is a copy of it.

Q. What should you think is a reasonable compensation to the person who arranged that plan, and made that drawing, and the others connected with that plan, and the prospectus?

A. That it would be almost impossible for me to tell; that must be governed by the trouble that was attendant upon it, and of course of that I cannot be a judge.

Lord Ellenborough. It is a very well drawn plan?

A. Certainly it is.

Mr. Brougham. Are you aware, that a plan of that kind cannot be made out, without a survey of the ground?

A. Certainly.

Q. Are you aware, that in making a plan of that sort, there are various other plans previously made, before it comes into that state?

A. No doubt, there must be.

Q. Can you take upon you, from that, and from your understanding of the manner in which such plans are made, to say what would be a fair reasonable compensation for the trouble bestowed?

A. Mr. Cochrane Johnstone, whom I saw upon the premises, made a representation to me——

Mr. Gurney. We cannot hear that.

Mr. Brougham. From your own knowledge of the subject, and the ground, what should you take to be a reasonable compensation?

A. It is so governed by the trouble attending it, that I cannot say, with any precision; I should judge, from the calculation of the trouble that must attend it, that a compensation of from two to three hundred pounds, might not be excessive.

—— M'Guire sworn.

Examined by Mr. Park.

Q. Are you the wife of the person who has just been here now?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you know Mr. De Berenger, when he lived at Chelsea?

A. No.

Q. Did you know Smith, his servant?

A. Yes.

Q. Did your husband on any day, and if so, on what day, mention to you his having seen Mr. De Berenger, Smith's master?

A. Yes, he did on the 20th February, about ten o'clock at night.

Q. When he came home?

A. Yes.

Q. How do you happen to know it was the 20th of February, more than the 13th or the 6th?

A. It was the Sunday before Shrove-tuesday.

Q. What led you to recollect it so particularly?

A. It was my child's birth-day.

Q. Do you mean that Shrove-tuesday was your child's birth-day, or that Sunday?

A. The Sunday; the first child I ever had in my life.

Q. On that day he told you he had seen Mr. De Berenger at his master's yard?

A. Yes, he did.

Lord Ellenborough. Did he tell you at what o'clock he saw him?

A. Yes; at about a quarter past six.

Q. Did he tell you that he thought it was shocking he should be out of the Rules?

A. Yes, he did; that he wondered whether he had got his liberty or not.

Q. Did he say it was shocking he should be out of the Rules?

A. I cannot particularly say, whether he said it was shocking or not.

Q. Had you known these Smiths long?

A. About three years and seven months.

Q. You are in the habits of visiting them sometimes?

A. Smith came backwards and forwards to Chelsea, when his master lived at the end of the bridge.

Q. Have you kept up your acquaintance with them, since they lived in Chelsea?

A. Yes, I have.

Q. You are very well acquainted with them?

A. Yes, I am.

Q. Had you seen him that day, the 20th?

A. No; I saw him that day fortnight.

Q. Your husband did not stay at home to keep the birth-day of his child?

A. No; my husband is an ostler, and he cannot come and go at his own time.

Q. But he mentioned about the Rules to you, did he?

A. Yes, he did; he said he should enquire from Smith, the first time he saw him, whether his master had got his liberty or not.

Q. Had your husband an anxiety to know whether he had got his liberty or not?

A. No, I cannot say that he seemed anxious, but he said he wondered how he came down there.

Henry Doyle Tragear sworn.

Examined by Mr. Richardson.

Q. Do you remember being at Mr. Donithorne's house, in York-street, Westminster, in the month of February last?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. Were you staying at his house?

A. Yes, I was.

Q. Living and sleeping there?

A. Yes.

Q. When did you go there?

A. I went there on the 17th of February.

Q. On what occasion?

A. I let my house, No. 39, Little Queen-street, Holborn, where I had carried on the hatting business, and I went from thence to Donithorne's.

Q. Was it on the 17th you let your house, finally.

A. Yes, it was.

Q. Did you stay at Mr. Donithorne's until or after the Sunday following, the 20th of February?

A. Yes, and until this very time.

Q. Are you acquainted with the prisoner Mr. De Berenger?

A. Yes, I have seen him frequently previously to that, at Mr. Donithorne's house.

Q. Do you or not, remember having seen him on Sunday the 20th of February?

A. Yes, very particularly on that day.

Q. Did you see him more than once on that day?

A. Yes, I saw him twice on that day.

Q. When was the first time you saw him?

A. Between nine and ten in the morning.

Q. When was the last time you saw him?

A. Between eight and nine in the evening of the same day.

Q. Did he stay any time when you saw him the last time on that day?

A. Yes, he did.

Q. Both these times you saw him in Mr. Donithorne's house?

A. Yes.

Q. How long did he stay when he came in the evening?

A. It might be somewhere about half an hour; I cannot exactly say; it might be an hour, or it might be less.

Q. Was it thereabouts, as nearly as you can remember?

A. Yes; it was, as nearly as I can remember.

Q. You are sure it was somewhere thereabouts?

A. Yes.

Q. Was he a visitor of Mr. Donithorne's, or did he come on business?

A. I have seen him frequently talking to Mr. Donithorne, about drawings, designs of furniture, and things of that sort.

Q. What is Donithorne?

A. He is a cabinet maker.

Q. You had seen him before that time?

A. Yes; Mr. Donithorne has shewn him to me.

Lord Ellenborough. What are you yourself?

A. A hat manufacturer by trade.

Q. You have been out of business since that time?

A. Yes, I have; not entirely out of business; but I have not a house at the present moment; I went there to reside, till I saw a house that would suit my purpose.

Q. He was talking with Mr. Donithorne?

A. Yes, he was.

Mr. Richardson. Was any body else present?

A. Yes; there was my wife, Mr. Donithorne and Mrs. Donithorne; we were in the parlour in the evening, when he came.

Q. Did he sit down?

A. He said that he would not come into the parlour to disturb the company; Mr. Donithorne went to the back part of the house with him, into the garden.

Q. Did he come into the parlour?

A. Yes, he did just come into the parlour; but he said he would not disturb the company.

Q. Did he afterwards come in?

A. I do not know whether he came in afterwards or not.

Q. But you saw him there?

A. I saw him in the house.

Q. You are well acquainted with his person?

A. Yes; I had seen him repeatedly before that.

Q. You did not see him after that?

A. No, I did not.

Cross-examined by Mr. Gurney.

Q. Do you remember being struck with any alteration in his appearance that night?

A. No.

Q. How long before that time had he left off wearing the large whiskers he used to have?

A. I cannot say.

Q. He had not them on that night?

A. I cannot say that I saw any alteration.

Q. He had no whiskers on that night?

A. No.

Q. He had never been used to wear whiskers?

A. That I cannot say.

Q. You knew him well, and had seen him often?

A. Yes.

Q. And you mean to say, you do not remember whether he wore whiskers on not?

A. He might or might not, I do not look so particularly into a gentleman's face, as to see whether he has whiskers or not.

Q. I happen to look at your face, and I cannot help seeing that you have whiskers, and a man who has such, might look at those on another person's face; do you mean to say, that in viewing the countenance of a gentleman you were acquainted with, you did not look so as to see whether he had whiskers?

A. Not unless a person spoke to me about them.

Q. Unless a person said "whiskers," you would not look at them?

A. No.

Q. Mr. De Berenger had not whiskers that night, however?

A. No.

Q. You were a hatter, in business at one time, and are not now?

A. Yes; I sell a great many hats now, though I have no house.

Q. Perhaps though you do not take notice of a man's whiskers, you take notice of his coat; what coat had he on?

A. A black coat.

Q. That you did take notice of?

A. Yes.

Q. It was so remarkable he should wear a black coat, you took notice of that?

A. No; I do not know that it is remarkable; but I know he had a black coat.

Q. Was his head powdered?

A. I cannot say; I did not see his hat off.

Q. He staid half an hour with his hat on?

A. He went into the back part of the house.

Q. Do you mean to say, he staid half an hour in the house with his hat on?

A. I do not mean to say, he stopped the whole time in house; he went into the garden.

Q. On the 20th of February he went into the garden?

A. Yes.

Lord Ellenborough. Did he stand ancle-deep in the garden, or how?

A. I cannot say, indeed.

Mr. Gurney. Was not there a good deal of snow at that time on the ground?

A. I cannot say, indeed.

Q. At what time was this?

A. Between eight and nine in the evening.

Q. And they took a walk in the garden?

A. Yes; it was in consequence of some alteration they were going to make in the premises.

Q. So that they went at ten o'clock at night to survey this alteration in the premises?

A. No; it was between eight and nine.

Q. It is just as dark then as it is at ten o'clock; they went to make a survey in the morning, did they not?

A. They had made a survey in the morning, I saw them pacing the garden.

Q. You told me they went out in the evening, to make a survey of the premises?

A. I cannot say what they went for, but I know they went there.

Q. Do you happen to know, whether Mr. Donithorne is acquainted with Mr. Tahourdin, the attorney?

A. I do not know whether he is acquainted with him, or not.

Q. You swear that?

A. I swear that; I do not know that he is acquainted with him particularly.

Q. Upon your oath have you not seen them together?

A. Yes, I have.

Q. Had not you seen them together before that time?

A. No, I had not.

Q. How often have you seen them together since?

A. I never saw them together but once.

Q. When was that?

A. One day last week.

Q. Do you mean to swear, that you did not know that they were acquainted with each other before that time?

A. Yes, I do.

Q. What is Mr. Donithorne; a cabinet-maker?

A. Yes.

Q. This you say was about making alterations in the garden; are they made?

A. No, they are not.

Q. They are waiting till February perhaps, to survey this garden again?

A. I do not know, indeed.

Q. When were you first sent for to become a witness on this occasion?

A. I never was sent for.

Q. When did you go to any person upon the subject?

A. I never went to any place upon the subject, further than going myself to Mr. Tahourdin; but he did not send for me.

Q. You went to Mr. Tahourdin without being sent for?

A. I went with Mr. Donithorne.

Q. When was that?

A. I cannot exactly say, but I think it was some day last week.

Q. Did you know before last week that you were to be a witness?

A. No, I did not.

Q. Did you know before last week, that it was at all material that you should recollect the 20th of February?

A. No, I did not know it; but I can tell you one particular thing that makes me recollect it; I let my house, No. 39, Little Queen-street, Holborn, on the 17th of February, to Samuel Nicholson, and went to Mr. Donithorne's to live; and on that very morning, the 20th, the Sunday, Mr. Donithorne (I rather indulge myself with lying in bed on Sunday morning) came to my door and knocked, and told me Mr. De Berenger was come to look over the house, and that if I would get up he should be obliged to me.

Mr. Gurney. I congratulate you on the cure of your deafness[417:A].

Lord Ellenborough. You lay a-bed and were disturbed?

A. No, not particularly; only I lay a-bed on the Sunday till about nine o'clock.

Lord Ellenborough. Do you know Smith, De Berenger's servant?

A. I have seen him.

Re-examined by Mr. Richardson.

Q. You saw them in this piece of garden in the morning?

A. Yes.

Q. My learned friend has asked, whether the alterations are carried into effect, or not?

A. They are not.

Q. Do you know, whether Mr. De Berenger went away after that?

A. He stopped about half an hour.

Q. Has he been absent from a period soon after the 20th of February?

A. Yes; I never heard much about him till last week.

Lord Ellenborough. When they came to you, you immediately recollected the 20th of February?

A. When who came down to me?

Q. When you went to Mr. Tahourdin, you immediately recollected the 21st of February?

A. He asked me, whether I could recollect on what day I came to this house; and I told him I do not know that I can recollect exactly; but I can go to Mr. Nicholson, upon whom I drew a bill at two months, for half the money for the goods and fixtures of my house, and ask him whether it is correct.

Q. He asked you, whether you recollected the 20th of February?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you say you recollected it by being disturbed in the morning?

A. Yes, I did.

Q. There was no snow in the garden when they paced it in the way you have spoken of?

A. I cannot positively say; I did not charge my memory with that.

Q. Are you perfectly certain in your recollection, as to having had your sleep disturbed?

A. Yes, I am perfectly certain of that.

Q. You know De Berenger very well?

A. I have seen him several times at Mr. Donithorne's house?

Q. And you know Tahourdin?

A. I never saw him till last week.

Q. Do you know where Mr. De Berenger dined that day?

A. No, I do not.

Q. At what time did he come in the morning?

A. Between nine and ten.

A Juryman. That might be any other Sunday morning, as you were in the habit of indulging on a Sunday morning?

A. No, but I know the time; it was the Sunday after I let my house; I have it impressed upon my mind that it was on the 20th of February I saw him at this house in York-street, Westminster.

A Juryman. Then the lying in bed in the morning had nothing to do with it?

A. No.

Lord Ellenborough. Have you ever been bail?

A. Yes.

Q. Have you ever justified in any action?

A. Yes.

Q. What action was that?

A. A fifteen-pound action.

Q. How long was that ago?

A. Five or six months.

Q. Is that debt paid?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you ever justify in any other action?

A. Yes, I have.

Q. Is that satisfied?

A. Yes.

Q. You are clear as to that, that these debts are paid?

A. Yes.

Q. Were you never bail but twice?

A. I do not recollect that I was; I might be, but I do not recollect; but I have not been in the habit of being bail for people.

Q. You have not been in the habit, but you have been twice:—what was the other sum besides the fifteen pounds?

A. I do not exactly know what the money was; but the other was more than that, a good deal.

Q. That is only within a few months?

A. I dare say that is five months back.

Lord Ellenborough. You may go away, and let me advise you not to be either a bail or a witness again. If the master had been here with the book, I have no doubt you might have gone much further with him.

FOOTNOTE:

[417:A] The Witness, at the commencement of the cross-examination, had affected not to hear; Mr. Gurney gradually sunk his voice, and at last spoke in a very low tone, and the Witness heard, notwithstanding.

Mrs. Tragear sworn.

Examined by Mr. Park.

Q. Are you the wife of the last witness, Mr. Doyle Tragear?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you know the Defendant, Mr. De Berenger?

A. Yes.

Q. Have you seen him often?

A. Yes, I have.

Q. Were you at Mr. Donithorne's house in the month of February last?

A. Yes.

Q. At what time did you and your husband go to stay there, after having given up your house?

A. The day we gave up our house was the 17th of February.

Q. And then you went down to Mr. Donithorne's?

A. Yes.

Q. What day of the month was it after you had gone there, that Mr. De Berenger called there?

A. On the Sunday.

Q. That would be on the 20th?

A. Yes.

Q. What time in the morning did he first call?

A. Between nine and ten.

Q. Do you remember, whether your husband was up or not, when he first came.

A. No, he was not.

Q. What is Mr. Donithorne?

A. He is in the cabinet business.

Q. Did you see Mr. De Berenger do any thing that morning?

A. Yes; Mrs. Donithorne came up (we were not up that morning) and desired us to get up and get our rooms ready, for that she had a gentleman to look over the house.

Q. In consequence of that you did get up?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you see Mr. De Berenger afterwards there, when you got up?

A. Yes; I saw him; I drew down the sash in the back room, and I saw him through the window; I saw him in the garden.

Q. Does the sash draw up or down?

A. Both.

Q. What was he doing in the garden?

A. He appeared to be measuring the ground, I believe.

Q. Had you any conversation with Mr. De Berenger at that time?

A. No.

Q. You are sure he was the man?

A. I am sure he was.

Q. Did you see him again that day at Mr. Donithorne's, and at what hour in the day?

A. I did; I saw him again in the evening.

Q. At what time?

A. Between nine and ten—I mean between eight and nine.

Q. Did he stay any time then?

A. I believe he did; we were in the parlour, along with Mr. and Mrs. Donithorne, and he came; and he (Mr. Donithorne) asked him to come in; and he said, he would not come in to disturb good company.

Q. Are you sure he was the man?

A. I am sure he was the man.

Q. How near was he to you?

A. We got up, of course, when the gentleman was coming in, and we saw the gentleman in the small parlour.

Q. What happened then, when you got up?

A. He went to speak with Mr. Donithorne, and they walked backwards into the garden.

Q. Did you see them go out of the door that leads into the garden?

A. Yes, I saw them go backwards.

Q. You did not go to look after what they were doing?

A. No.

Q. Did you afterwards see them again, after they came from the back part of the house?

A. No, I did not.

Q. You saw Mr. De Berenger no more?

A. No.

Cross-examined by Mr. Bolland.

Q. How long has your husband had the affliction of deafness?

A. He has, at times.

Q. So we have seen to-day; you were indulging that morning in bed, as well as your husband?

A. Yes.

Q. And Mrs. Donithorne came to wake you?

A. Yes.

Q. It was natural she should do it?

A. Yes.

Q. Mr. Donithorne did not wake you?

A. No.

Q. But Mrs. Donithorne came and waked you, and wished you to get up, because somebody was coming to see the house?